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The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver 
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
I always forget about fighters since I never play them outside of slaying :lol:

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Sat May 19, 2012 6:23 am
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
first off, waking terrors is a TERRIBLE card. Thats right i said it. Helps shut down front line fighters you say?

If you're lucky you might get 2 ranks, but 1 rank isn't worth it cause this little card called griffon of misear (which every good fighter deck should have) and when only getting 1 rank from a card you might as well take viper whip. Next, if you do succeed to move them, they will always be behind a character, because they have to be. So no for sure illegal rank, which means all those movement cards they have in their hand, will have plenty of time to move them up. Not to mention, they already have 1 steed to work with. All in all, it just isn't as clutch as any of the other cards in the deck, and i would never be able to find room for it.

And on the note of movement, that's not how i built the deck. The deck just focuses on conjure storm and incinerate to finish the job from rank 3 utilizing my proxy. Xaros would be bad because of a lack of a 2nd hp, and the 2nd cardinal would have been overkill/wasted card. Since these characters are mostly swinging with dull swords movement really wouldn't have done much.

While i agree with what your mentor that "speed and disruption are a powerful combination" kestrel is all about patience over speed.

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Fri May 25, 2012 3:59 pm
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
for cards like this to be effective you need:

4+ cards similar in the format
a way to punish into a path to victory the pushing back.

in this format you have (with similar effects)

Waking Terrors
Dimensional Rift
Teleport

I am leaving out cards like Thunderclap Bracers and Titan because they really do not fit too well into the setup. they require so many different factors (position in the army structure and successful strike to name two) to be too reliable.

the punish card, and the only one I can think of in the format is Seek Out Thine Enemy and that is situational as well. Granted, a Titan with SOTE and a deck built around it can more effectively use Waking Terrors, but in all honesty, the card is sub par in the format.

now, that said, I love this card and play it. I wish Forgotten made its way back with it, bt it did not.

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Fri May 25, 2012 8:12 pm
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
Waking Terrors isn't useless, it's just not great. Take Chase's (Kamacausey) Sir Robert deck that won the Chicago WC for example. He buffs Isabelle with 4 strikes and has three Clerimonde in the discard. Depending on his rank structure, a well timed Waking Terrors could really screw up his offense forcing him to use x2-3 Clermonde just to get a single attack out of her. He'd at least lose one use of Clermonde to the Waking Terrors, but potentially more if the rank structure is in your favor. Otherwise, he waits until the end of turn to do everything and saves a Sacrifice for Dreiga to use.

Take a Rabinus deck (several WC were won by him) for example. Putting a raging Barrett Yscar in the fifth rank isn't useful? He has +5 Skill. If not, you can expect to whop on him for several turns with Soothing Waters and Rabinus reductions.

Texas WC was won by Brymin. After two movement cards are used to get her to the front, you know what shuts down Obliterate -> Onslaught -> Bloodthirsty? Being in rank 3. Same goes for Winter who won at least one WC and GenCon last year. They will come forward again, but they lost a turn to a well-timed Waking Terrors.

Is it typically better to just deal damage? Yes. But Waking Terrors is a card that can be useful in a pinch. For Kestrel specifically, though, I think it's out shined by other cards.

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Fri May 25, 2012 10:16 pm
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
nilonka wrote:
for cards like this to be effective you need:

4+ cards similar in the format
a way to punish into a path to victory the pushing back.

in this format you have (with similar effects)

Waking Terrors
Dimensional Rift
Teleport


Phantom Steed also, right?

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Sat May 26, 2012 10:48 am
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
devlukelorian wrote:
first off, waking terrors is a TERRIBLE card. Thats right i said it. Helps shut down front line fighters you say?


There are very few cards in 4E I would consider "TERRIBLE" my friend, and Waking Terrors is definetly not on that list.

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Mon May 28, 2012 7:14 pm
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
Oremm wrote:
nilonka wrote:
for cards like this to be effective you need:

4+ cards similar in the format
a way to punish into a path to victory the pushing back.

in this format you have (with similar effects)

Waking Terrors
Dimensional Rift
Teleport


Phantom Steed also, right?


I was going for just straight orders, but yes. the bonus to the Phantom Steed is that a low level can do it and target anyone...like a druid and Mud Slick.

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Tue May 29, 2012 2:40 pm
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
First off, i retract terrible, and say subpar. It doesn't get the job done nearly as well as other cards but i know why it can be useful. If Kestrel, for example, was the old version instead of this one i would play terrors in the deck.

For every example outside of rabinus/barrett, i would take icy surge or viper whip over them. Its the simple lack of versatility that makes it a difficult card to place. The amount of value it gives is outweighed by the other cards in the deck. I also agree with nilonka, if there was more ways to punish the movement i would consider it, but there just isn't.

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Tue May 29, 2012 7:34 pm
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
Waking Terrors hurts Kestrel as well. 50% chance against most of his targets to completely nullify his ability.

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Wed May 30, 2012 9:08 am
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
Woodrow wrote:
Waking Terrors hurts Kestrel as well. 50% chance against most of his targets to completely nullify his ability.

Except then he just changes it to a different character.

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Wed May 30, 2012 1:17 pm
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Post Re: The Deverenians of 4E: Kestrel the Deceiver
Except it's once per turn. "Yes you are!" "No I'm not!" "Yes you are!" "No I'm not!"

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nilonka wrote:
there are five people on this website anymore, Woodrow: me you, Nihil, Wendy, and they guy who loves Trench as a warlord. You can't afford to disagree. WE NEED THESE TOURNEY KITS!!!!!

Kerebrus wrote:
Woodrow, your jank may have crossed the line this time.


Tue Jun 05, 2012 5:21 pm
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